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guidance questions:
1. What does Socrates seek to know from Euthyphro? Be precise.
2. What's the relationship between gods and piety?
3. Though there is no conclusion, what have you learned from this discussion?
As I was reading the text Apology by Plato, I was kind of confused. However, by the middele of the reading I started to understand about it. Socrates is being accused such things such as being a corruptor and so on. He starts to defenf himself from these accusations, but he does not apology at all. I really liked this text because Socrates does not apologize from what he calls, ''good words, but not true''. The reason why is because if a false statement is against a person, that person has the right to defend him/herself, but not to apologize.
ReplyDeleteKhadeeja Richardson
ReplyDeleteJust like yania i too was confused at the start of this reading ... but what i did get is that Socrates Was seeking answers from Euth. He started by asking him "And what is piety, and what is impiety?"..... he later asks him what to me seems to be religious questions to understand the gods how they think.Over all i got from this very confusing passage that Scorates was trying to gain a better understand of the gods and how they judge people. I think even Euth was doing the same when he kinda mentioned the hypocrisy of the gods when they were punishing him for prosicuteing his father when Zeus if fact did something similar ...Other then that i was confused
Nathalis Lopez
ReplyDeleteEuthyphro by Plato was written in 380 B.C.E. This story took place in the porch of the king Archon. Socrates have left the lyceum, because Meletus have been prosecuted him, this time he is accusing Socrates of been a poet a maker of gods, and that he invent new gods and deny the existence old ones. Euthyphro who is Socrates friend is giving Socrates some advised and guide related to his case. Euthyphro is the pursuer of his own father, his father is been accused of murder of a poor man who work for Euthyphro family, the man one day in a fit of drunken got into a quarrel with one of the domestic servants which make his father committed that crime. During the whole dialogue Socrates and Euthyphro are having a conversation in which they are trying to defined piety. Socrates hope he can learn from Euthyphro all the better to defend himself in his own trial.
Being that Euthyphro claims to be an expert in piety "holiness", Socrates goes to Euthyphyro in the form of a student seeking knowledge on religious matter to help in his defense against Meletus. However, through Socrates cross examination of ironic questioning of Euthyphro definition of Piety, he allows Euthyphro to see through his own words that his own definition may not be entirely true and that he being narrow minded. Socrates makes him realize that piety should only be defined by the common ideals amongst many gods and not by an example led by only one god. I think this demonstrates to be open and look beyond and gather as many facts as you can before making a decision
ReplyDeleteIn the article Euthyphro, Socrates was being accused by Meletus of corrupting the youth. Socrates goes on to Euthyphro to understand and get taught what makes something right or wrong. Euthyphro uses the gods to explain the situation of him accusing his father of murder by saying that there is no reason for the public to think of his actions towards his father being wrong if the gods have done the same. Socrates explains that the public, as also the gods, agree and disagree on certain actions. If the gods themselves act wrongfully, how can anyone say what's piety. In other words there is no right or wrong way of seeing things.
ReplyDeleteIn Plato's Euthyphro, Plato brings back the accusations made against Socrates of corrupting the youth. On the other hand, Socrates tries to know more about religion from Euthyphro (whom father has been accused of murder), when he says to Socrates that he has a good understanding of it. Moreover, Socrates wants to know the difference between piety and impiety to help defend himself from the accusations against him. Euthyphro explains to him the meaning of both words. I believe that Socrates is very smart, in the way that he seeks an understanding which he does not possesses, in order to use it in the trial.
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ReplyDeleteIn Euthyphro, Socrates encounters Euthyphro outside the court of King-Archon in Athens and is asked why he is there. Socrates proceeds to tell Euthyphro that he has been called to court on charges of "impiety" (which i didnt understand why) by Meletus. Euthyphro asks Socrates how Meletus came to his accusation. Socrates than tells Euthyphro that Meletus accuses him of corrupting the youth of Athens by being a maker of gods and that he invents new gods while denying the existence of the old ones. Euthyphro tells Socrates that he understands what he is saying and tries to repeat himself. Euthyphro says that Meletus believes that Socrates is attacking him for saying that the divine sign keeps coming to him.
ReplyDeleteEuthyphro is a dialogue between two men that are dealing with issues that relate to the law. The difference is that Socrates is being accused of corrupting the youth and Euthyphro is opposing his father in the court of law for murder. Euthyphro is a man who is known to be wise in religious matters. However, Socrates uses Socratic irony to point out that this man has very little knowledge of what is holy and unholy. Socrates brings up arguments that the man cannot answer, he makes it seem as if Euthyphro is teaching him meanwhile he is aware of the fact that he himself is much wiser than Euthyphro. He brings up a serious of arguments that eventually come full circle and lead nowhere, they do not come to a conclusion and at the end of the dialogue Euthyphro leaves without any explanation, it seems that the man got frustrated because Socrates proved Euthyphro’s ignorance and lack of knowledge in his own field. The ending of the dialogue perhaps suggests that there is no answer or resolution to this type of argument.
ReplyDeleteCesar Herrera
ReplyDeletePHI 100 SEC 141
I was very confused with the text but managed to get a few things out of it. Euthyphro was written by Plato and it is a dialogue between Socrates and Euthyphro. Socrates is specifically trying to find out what piety exactly is. Socrates was at times sarcastic towards Euthyphro like at the end after their whole dialogue Socrates says
"Alas! my companion, and will you leave me in despair? I was hoping that you would instruct me in the nature of piety and impiety"
Even though they just finished trying to define it. They both brought up examples of what piety is. And both couldn't agree. Euthyphro seemed to be having enough of Socrates sarcastic remarks that he in the end just tells him he's in a rush and must go. I think this reading is a dialogue that tries to give an example have there is no right or wrong. Also that if you aren't open minded before arguments occur that in the end you'll be right back where you started.
Shaunice C. Hayes
ReplyDeleteSec. 141
During the conversation both Socrates and Euthyphro confused me a little. I felt like Euthyphro was holding back some of the knowledge he knew of the gods. At the end when the last thing Socrates said he was hoping for a full understanding of the god's, that came off to me as like he was just using him at the time, so he could get Meletus off his case about him corrupting youth. Its like in the beginning of the conversation Euthyphro was eager to talk about what the gods think about piety and impiety, but as the conversation went on he was making Socrates pry it out of him.
The main topic of the conversation was Socrates getting knowledge on piety and impiety in relation to the god's so Meletus would falsely think that Socrates is moving on to a "better" life. Piety is what the gods appreciate, like prayer and honor. Impiety is what is not dear to the god's, what they don't appreciate. Socrates gave an example, Euthyphro kind of agreed but disagreed of it at the same time and vise versa. Basically Socrates didn't accomplish a full understanding of it, not enough to try Meletus in court.
Kevin Granados
ReplyDeletePHI 100-141
In Euthyphro by Plato, Socrates was being accused by Meletus of corrupting the youth of Athens. Socrates speaks with Euthyphro to understand what makes something right or wrong. Euthyphro uses the gods as an example to explain the situation of accusing his father of murder by saying that there is no reason for the public to think of his actions towards his father being wrong if the gods have done the same. Socrates then explains that the gods agree and disagree on certain actions as well. If the gods themselves act wrongfully, how can anyone say what is piety. In other words there is no good or evil way of seeing things, because I believe that good or evil is one main idea. Right or wrong is the justification that one mind perceives because basically we are all one conscience. The conversation between Socrates and Euthyphro is the progression of humans understanding our true nature of negativity and positivity.
Saleem Javaid
ReplyDeleteAfter reading this discussion between Socrates, and Euthyphro i started to have a better understanding of what Socrates was trying to get out to the public. I also came to a better understanding of why he was being accused of the crime the accusers charged him with. Throughout this discussion Socrates asked a series of questions to his friend Euthyphro about piety, and what do the gods view as piety and impiety. Although, Socrates knew the answer to most of these questions, he wanted to be reassured that his theories about piety was accurate. Throughout the discussion Socrates discussed the the gods can think something thats unjust can be pious, but if then the unjust is pious then how would we know whats difference between piety and impiety? Truthfully speaking I believe Socrates has made a valid point and proved that he is in fact right, but just does not have the adequate resources to prove his innocence. I put myself in Socrates is position and wonder if i would be as calm and collective as him? Still making wise accusations and throwing out information that is absolutely accurate? Then i figure out that i cant. I would be panicking, knowing I may be sentenced to death. Yet he's confident he will reach out to the many people who doubt him. At the end of this discussion Euthyphro leaves Socrates in a hurry. As what i felt was a sarcastic but honest remark was what Socrates stated at the end.
The conversation between Euthyphro and Socrated was very interesting to me. Socrates was trying to find a common ground between impiety and piety and the unjust or justly truth in meletus case against him. Socrates wanted Euthyphro to help him prove his innocence by helping the understand the just act of being for the gods(piety) and those whom were against them(impiety). But with every answer Euthyphro was given Socrates quickly found a flaw. Socrates is trying to, but not obviously, get Euhtyphro to understand that he himself is a definition of piety because of his actions towards his father.
ReplyDeleteJacobo Juliao
ReplyDeletePHI 100 sec141
I think Socrates is a vey meticulous man; he makes sure that he's actions,ideas, and words are accurate before speaking of them. This makes Socrates a very wise man. It is as the Bible says: "He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him"(Provrs 18:13). I believe that this is the case with Euthyphro. He thinks he knows about what is piety and impiety, but in reality he doesn't. He didnt examine the ideas of piety and impiery very carefully;therefore, speaking of something you dont know, or acting upon an idea you dont completely understand is not a very wise thing to do. For this reason Socrates wants to know whether Euthyphro understand the idea of piety and impiety before basing his actions on these ideas.
Acording to Socrates even the gods dont agreed on what is piety and impiety. for him it is as if there is not universal standard to deem whether an action is piety or impiety, pious or impious, just or unjust. But I think there is an universal law we can use to determine if an action is just or unjust: Don't do to others what you dont want others do to you.
socrates seek to learn from Euthyphro, 'What is the meaning of peity and impiety'. even though Euthyphro could not give a single definition as socrates would of liked. he also could not expalin it as clearlly as socrates wanted and socrates pointed out all the faults of the gods when its concerns with piety and impiety which comes back full circle to what Euth said in the begining that what every the gods liked is peity and whatever they dont like is impeity, so what they like is holy and what every they dislike is unholy.so if one god don't like what a another god does so it will be unholy or unplesant to that god .Soc is saying the we cant be wrong or right because "any state of acton or passion implies previous action or passion. it does not becomes because it is becoming...." I get from this that we are in the a state of now in time the present so how can we please or offend the gods .In the end of the diaolog Socrates pointed out to Euthphro (the irony) that how can he know what piety and impiety is if he is going to prosecute his father of murder and run the risk of offending the gods and the respect of man. i think that socrates knew their is no one answer but he wants Euthyphro to see the irony and how silly it is the act of pious and impious it is to be to the gods
ReplyDeletephil 100 sec 141,
ReplyDeleteI like this passage very much because Socrates may seem as he was challenging his friend Euthyphro, but he was not and his friend understood that. socrates was mearely just asking the right questions in order to understand things. being that this is the case in how socrates learn, this was why Meletus and other authorities felt taken back by this man who is said to be considered wise that went about asking questions only that he might understand the answer.
Here Socrates was trying to get a basic definition of impious and pious. he said "But I will amend the definition so far as to say that what all the gods hate is impious, and what they love pious or holy; and what some of them love and others hate is both or neither." how is it possible for the gods to find favor in something that is of evil and yet be of a holy sense.
Euthyphro by Plato was a bit confusing to me. Story is a dialogue between two men named Socrates and Euthyphro. Socrates approaches Euthyphro with questions about piety and impiety. Euthyphro avoids the question by giving Socrates examples and how he faces piety and impiety in his life. He does give full explanations of the words meaning.Socrates later ask him about Holines and Euthyphro still avoids Socrates questions. Socrates was looking for answers about piety or holiness so Meletus won’t be accuse him of impiety. Socrates question Euthyphro about how the gods feel about piety and impiety. Socrates believes that what is loved by man is hated by man and what is loved by gods is hated by gods.
ReplyDeleteAfter reading the text Euthypro by Plato, I have come to the conclusion that, the whole concept of the text, was for Socrates to get a good perspective of Euthypro's relgious knowledge of what piety and impiety truly was, As according to the Gods. So that Socrates could better understand the motives of the Athens and Meletus, due to the fact that he was accused of being ungodly and a youth corrupter. In Socrates opinion, if the Athens are so religious he deserved a second chance to live.
ReplyDeleteIn addition, Socrates wanted to understand clearly why Euth would charge his aged father of a murder,that he claimed was unjust,if Euth really he didnt know how to explain his own ideas.
More importantly, Zeus was veiwed as the most righteous and also bounded his father, yet Euth's family was against his decision to condemned is father. In my opinion this was very contradictory and hypocritical.
The relationship between Gods and piety is that the Gods were feared and honored; therefore doing what the Gods loved is being pious. Rather than being pious for the love of it. Being religious for the wrong reasons if you as me. This text concludes what the first text (Apology) implied about "accusations" and "truth".
Murad Alhidami
ReplyDeleteThis story was very interesting to me because Socrates who is a very wise man ased some questions tha could change the minds of the people.socrates wants to learn from Euthyphro, which is Socrates friend. He goes about the whole thing by asken questions like 'What is the meaning of peity and impiety'?. Socrates was a man who wanted to know every thing about life and if you couldnt answer the question he would then ask another question. socrates also was a man who called out all the faults of the gods when its concerns with piety and impiety. Socrates was being accused of corropting the youth and trying to change the believe in god. With all the pride Socrates had he wouldnt let something wrong go, he simpliy said everything that was on his mind and let it get the best of him. Overall after reading the story and seeing what my fellow class mates had to say it seems that most of use are on the same page to believe that Socrates is in the right but because the people dont like him they want to accuse him of corroption.
After reading Euthyphro by Plato, I found myself inside a long chain of riddles. The question of “what the definition of holiness is?” is constantly answered with more and more questions. And all this started with Socrates suggesting that Euthyphro must be a great expert in religious matters. But the question I have whether or not Socrates really thought Euthyphro was a great expert in the topic of Holiness. Because I believe whenever Socrates praises someone, that it also means that there is a problem with that someone. This was evident in the first story “Apology”, where Socrates praised that his accusers as skillful speakers. In reality, everyone including me liked to be praised for things we have done or knowledge that we have. But the fact is looking at Socrates, it reminded me that praises should be a warning sign. Because it is only when we are praised, we reveal our weakness and problems that others can easierly expose.
ReplyDelete"Euthyphro" by plato is a very interesting story. The part thats stands out me the most is that Euthyphro without emotion just prosecutes his father because of his unjust actions. No mercy and without hesitations do his actions lie. Even Socrates his friend was baffled that he could actually do this to his own father and tries to persuade him not to do it. But Euthyphro was not moved and explained his actions being similar to Zeus punishing his father for his wrongful doings which was devouring his brothers. I think that the relationship between Euthyphro and his father was not healthy for Euthyphro to have done this.
ReplyDeleteEuthyphro is a man that is known for being a religious expert and he is charging his own father with murder. Socrates questions Ethuyphro, "what is piety"? Euthyphro gives Socrates different example and definitions for piety, such as, "piety is what is pleasing to the gods". however, Socrates was not satisfied with the definition Euthyphro was giving him. And he felt that there was no standard definition for piety that can defend him in his trial.
ReplyDeleteDuring a conversation on the porch of the King Archon, Euthyphro informs Socrates of his upcoming affair. He stated he was prosecuting his father for murdering a family worker because it is piety. But when Socrates questioned Euthyphro of the meaning of piety, Euthyphro failed to come up with a definite defined answer. Euthyphro first defined the word as prosecuting anyone who is guilty of a crime. When Socrates began to cross examine his answer it appears that there isn't a just answer to his question. At first Socrates appeared to be using Euthyphro and his religious teachings as a rebound to pass the blame onto. From what I can conclude, Socrates is a wise man that is using plain language to listen and verbally analyze Euthyphro's teachings to develop his challenge against Meletus.
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ReplyDeleteSocrates in this book is asking euthypro whether he knows the true nature of piety or not so that it can be made clear that the criminal action he has taken against his father is good or not. According to euthypro piety is something that is pleasing to all the gods and is a relationship between gods and humans as a process of giving and receiving. We give prayers and sacrifices to gods and in turn receive material benefits from god. Socrates rejects this idea by saying that our duty towards god is to do something that can promote the moral and spiritual development of human beings. He also says that religion is not a tool of getting something what we want from god but religion is to bring our life into harmony with the will of the god. Euthypro believes that all pious person are just but all just person are not pious. Religion and morality are related to each-other and cannot exist without each-other. Socrates believes morality is different from our own opinion in accordance to the will of the god.
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